First off, I wish all of these people who are blaming Bush for Katrina can tell me/prove to me that life and the world would really be that different if Bush did everything they say he should have.

Hint Hint, Robert Kennedy Jr.!!

Now, Katrina was a

bitch

To me it is kinda like “Let the Buyer Beware..!!”.

As to the Gas Price increases, let us build more refineries and that will ease the crunch.

David

I saw Casey Sheehans’s mother on fox, i missed some of it but it was talking about how she blamed bush for not having enough Guard members down there, that there was too many overseas in the war.

i mean the worst natural disaster in this nations history, that wipes out a city, and what does this type like more sheehans and others do? attack bush.

i saw one lefty blog with posting from people saying it was god hitting the red states for putting bush in, others didn’t believe that..no it was a plan by the rich whtie republicans to drown the black poor democrats by witholding money.

ever time i think i have seen the worst from that kind, i’m proven wrong, there is no limit to how low they can go.

To turn this into politics is absolutly sickening. SICKENING.

I saw Casey Sheehans’s mother on fox, i missed some of it but it was talking about how she blamed bush for not having enough Guard members down there, that there was too many overseas in the war.

I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure that they’ve not called the entire national guard for those states, just a large portion of them.

As for the levees...number one, that totally ignores what happened to the rest of Louisiana, Missippi, Alabama, Florida, West Virginia, Georgia, Kentucky, Tennessee, Virginia, Pennsylvania, and New York. There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions effected, and at least a hundred dead and quite possibly more even when ignoring New Orleans. That may be the situation that’ll take longest to fix, but its not the only problem here.

Number two, what they knew would happen was that the city was effectivly in a bowl surrounded by water on three sides...if water got in, even from rain, it would have been a big problem. Number three, I believe, according to predictions, the levees were SUPPOSED to hold for how much of the storm hit New Orleans. Now, had Katrina hit head-on..thats entirly different.

Also, to argue that the point was to drown people...then I think those people have a different definition of what “MANDATORY EVACUATION” means. I still have great sympathy for those that died or are stranded in New Orleans, but its not like there was some plan to keep them there.

DU has been beating this since before Katrina hit, that it was going to be Bush’s fault.  At least I know where they got it from.

Way to be despicable, Moore.

Just worth putting in here…

Things are going to turn out OK. This is America. We’ve had tragedies before. Now it’s New Orleans’ turn.

We understand and accept that our homes aren’t there, but whatever we have to do to get our lives back to normal, we’ll do it.
New Orleans is going to recover. This is America. We will rebuild, and it will be better.

But this is America. In another country, you wouldn’t see people pulling together like this. We’re not fighting over food and shelter. We are blessed people.
One more thing. I’m a security guard. My husband delivers medical supplies and can drive an 18-wheeler. Put us to work. Let us do what we do best.

The minute they say we can go back, I’ll be volunteering to search for people. Whatever it takes.

http://www.nola.com/newslogs/breakingtp/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/2005_08.html#075547

Those are all things said by people that lived in New Orleans and are now refugees. Why is it that they might have just lost everything, yet they have more faith and optomism in America and a greater willingness to help than people that decide to politicise this to somehow show that america is somehow bad?

Also, to argue that the point was to drown people...then I think those people have a different definition of what “MANDATORY EVACUATION” means. I still have great sympathy for those that died or are stranded in New Orleans, but its not like there was some plan to keep them there.

Perhaps they thought it was some sexist phrase they couldn’t bothered to learn the meaning of,
Or they thought it was a government program of force-feeding everybody laxatives in order to reduce the need to use a toilet after the storm.

/sarcasm off

Seriously, I find so incredibly hair raising that people are using this disaster to try to make political capital against Bush.  Their pettiness is so childish, and it lacks empathy for the thousands who have had their life turned upside down.

The German Environmental minister (a member of the Greens) decided to indicate that this Hurricane was Bush’s fault because he pulled out of the Kyoto agreement.  It has been caused by global warming, after all!  Ignoring most scientists clear message that the formation of the hurricane and the hurricane activity in general is not affected sea temperature to any great extent and that the last thirty years were actually below the average when it came to hurricane formation, he decides to take a jab at the US after one of the worst storms on record.  (Since record keeping of these things started in the 1800’s I think)

So, to avoid feeling compassion for the people living in the areas worst affected by the storms, he manages to assuage his conscience by trying to blame the victims for their own hardship.  That’s really nice.  I wonder how much Jürgen Trittin (afforementioned minister) gives to international help organisations?

To give Mikey credit, he tries to tie his politicising to something a little more concrete.  Whether or not the levees could have held even with the extra Federal money that Mike claims could have stopped the flooding, (in hindsight) should rather be left to the engineers who will be responsible for building them up again. 

I think they are in a better position to be able to judge what would have held up under a cat 4-5 hurricane storm surge.  And the primary focus of everybody ahould be to help the victims of the storm and build the city again, not to parcel out blame.  It seems so childish to me.  The main thing should be building up so that they can avoid similar situations in the future, and giving the good people of that area a chance to start living again.

(But that would require an empathy that Mikey or the extreme left does not seem to have.)

link:

http://www.netzeitung.de/deutschland/355498.html

It’s in German but I think Fox started picking it up now, and the Norwegain media was eager to cover it and started splashing their newspapers with the “it’s Americas own fault” that a hurricane has struck her. Never mind the latitude the location of her southeast coast in relationship to the hurricane season and areas of the Atlantic that form these storms, she pulled out of the Kyoto agreement and she deserves the retribution of nature! 

Disgusting.

I hope Mikey won’t stoop that low, but he’s disappointed me many times before.

You won’t get any help from Moore’s fat ass or anyone like him for that matter.

But I’m sure Mikey and his mooreons will be ok, as giddy as ever, Just like the 7 mentions of Traverse City.

I guess with all of those links plus the Sheeba links, he hasn’t had the time to say one word of condolence to the Katrina victims.

His “link of the week” tells anyone all they need to know about this bastard. The link of the week is a story about the gas guzzling 3 bus tour across the country where I’m sure they will bitch and moan about oil. Ironic isn’t it?

The German Environmental minister (a member of the Greens) decided to indicate that this Hurricane was Bush’s fault because he pulled out of the Kyoto agreement.  It has been caused by global warming, after all!  Ignoring most scientists clear message that the formation of the hurricane and the hurricane activity in general is not affected sea temperature to any great extent and that the last thirty years were actually below the average when it came to hurricane formation, he decides to take a jab at the US after one of the worst storms on record.  (Since record keeping of these things started in the 1800’s I think)

Exactly what bugs me...this “well, thats what you get for global warming” attitude. When Katrina made landfall the second time, it was the 3rd most intense huricane at time of landfall recorded. The two above it? THe Labor Day Hurricane in 1935 and Hurricane Camille in 1969. In fact, if we keep going down the most intense hurricanes historically, while #4 is Andrew in 1992, after that it goes #5-7 as hurricanes in 1886, 1919, and 1928, 8 is Donna in 1960, 9 was unnamed in 1915, 10 was Carla in 1961, 11 was LA in 1856, and then 12 was Hugo in 1989. 13-15 were in 1900, 1898, and 1954.
including katrina, a whole 3 of the 15 most intense hurricanes to hit the u.s. since they’ve been recording have been in the last 35 years. That just screams global warming, doesn’t it?

He just wants to make political capital using a natural catastrophe as his catalyst.  I’m sure if they could have somehow try to imply earthquakes are affected global warming, he would would have been blaming the US for the SE Asia tsunami.

It is shameless and so totally devoid of any kind of humanity or logical thinking.

I just believe that if someone throws out a genuinly stupid idea, the proper responce is to show that and put it out in the open and not just let it slide.

I’ve seen the argument thrown out by a few other liberals long before Mikey even picked up the story. So to say that Moore was even the instigator on this one can’t be said, he’s just copycatting.

Seriously I don’t know what people expect from the levees when a 30 foot storm surge hits the city that lies well below sea level. Even if they had been built to 40 feet tall, it wouldn’t have stood up to Katrina.

Also, to argue that the point was to drown people...then I think those people have a different definition of what “MANDATORY EVACUATION”

Have you ever been to New Orleans?  There’s looting on your average Friday night there.  Anyone who left there home guarded simply by a door lock would have lost everything anyway, so why not stay?

ken:
Anyone who left there home guarded simply by a door lock would have lost everything anyway, so why not stay?

I’m a little confused by this statement.  Given the choice between losing everything and drowning, and losing everything and living in the Astrodome for a month, I know which one I’d take.

Of course, it being the Astrodome, that makes the choice somewhat tougher than if the Superdome had stayed intact, or if Bank of America Stadium were available.

lowbacca:
number one, that totally ignores what happened to the rest of Louisiana, Missippi, Alabama, Florida, West Virginia, Georgia, Kentucky, Tennessee, Virginia, Pennsylvania, and New York.

Ohio got hit by that hurricane too, you insensitive prick!
:) <-- denotes humorous intent

We didn’t come out too bad, actually.  Got several inches of rain dumped on us but at least there’s not 5 feet of rubble piled in my front yars.

By gar, it’s been a while....
Is anyone surprised that Moore would not spend his multi-millions (given to him, apparently, by the multi-millions who like what he does) to help those who are obviously in need of it but spend his time pointing fingers at his favourite scapegoat? Of course. Why? Because he is an asshole. No further discussion on this matter is needed.
As for the disaster in New Orleans and Mississippi state, people were warned that this unstoppable force of nature was headed their way. If they could not flee, why did they not get provisions? As cruel as this will sound, this just smacks of stupidity.
As for looters, shoot them where they stand. They are forms of scum to reduce themselves this low.
I believe, short of the worst earthquake California a few years back, the US has not seen anything like this. The resources people are doing what they can and as expediently as they can (from what I can tell, anyway).

Further proof that Moore-on has no human feeling at all.

As for the looting, it seems to me they’re being more dumb than not caring. I saw a clip of this one guy coming out of a store lugging a TV with him. Now let’s see, his home is probably underwater to a degree, and even if it wasn’t, there’s no power. What’s he going to do? Haul it under his arm for a while until this is all over? God gave you a brain mister, please at least try to use it.

The link of the week is a story about the gas guzzling 3 bus tour across the country where I’m sure they will bitch and moan about oil. Ironic isn’t it?

Funny, I was thnking the same thing aboutsaving fuel

Dag nabbit…

I was half asleep this morning, looking through newsmedia and blogs, and ran across a quote from (what I believe was) a foreign (I hesitate to dignify as such) dignatary, who said (and I am paraphrasing) that the US shouldn’t be surprised by a lack of outpouring of compassion and support over Katrina, because “the US has used up it’s sympathy”.

Does anyone recall seeing that quote, and know where it was?

- iirightii

The scene in New Orleans continues to get more repugnant by the minute.  Someone decided to fire a few rounds at a military helicopter that was being used to transport refugees:

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/09/01/D8CBHB4O7.html

Not to lay blame on moore, DU, and the moveon.org types, but where would one get the misplaced anger to open fire on a military vehicle that was being used to help people?  I heard a New Orleans refugee being interviewed yesterday saying that “It’s time for these people to get theirs, they deserve it” in reference to the looting.  I feel badly for those who have lost but these other idiots are trying my patience.  I’m trying to remember the public’s response in NYC during the days following 9/11 and I can’t remember this kind of response from NYC residents at all.

PS - I wonder if we can count on the Italian Red Cross to lend a hand?

I was bored so I found the “Alan Combs” radio show and gave a listen.  They were on about how the tax cut are part of the reason that New Orleans is in trouble.  That money diverted from work on the dams and such was sent to Iraq.

I got news for these guys, you could have steel dams there and it isn’t going to stop a cat 4 or 5 hurricane from kicking the shit out of them. 

Typical liberals, “It couldn’t be that massive weather system that did the damage, it must be tax cuts”.  What a crock of shit.

Fuck the Germans and the Kyoto treaty.  The only reason (ONLY) that these countries want the US involved in all these things is because they know that our Constitution recognizes treaties as law.  This means that they have the ability to control by having us sign treaties.  Bush is no more responsible for Katrina then a rooster is for making the sun shine.  That’s so silly it’s not really worth getting into.

Oh and about the looters, I know some of their names, Exxon, Shell, Citgo, Conoco etc.  Fucking gas went from 2.50 yesterday while I was out to over 3.00, WTF is that?

The government regulates my cable bill, my phone bill and this other incidental shit, where the fuck are they when the companies that supply the lifes blood the economy are bending me over?  Don’t get me wrong, I am all about making money, but if there has to be oversight don’t you think it should be for stuff that is important?  Shit, if I don’t want to pay 70 a month for TV, I can survive, different story when it comes to gas.

They were on about how the tax cut are part of the reason that New Orleans is in trouble.

What is so weak about this argument, besides the fact the the tax cut affected projects that were years away from even being started, is that they apparently think that a certain project is critical to saving them, but they won’t do it unless the federal government pays for it.  I’d certainly have a hard time explaining to the police that I was robbed and I didn’t lock my front door because the city refused to buy me a lock.  I see New Orleans had enough money to bring in the Hard Rock Casino and put on one hell of a Mardi Gras this year.  Perhaps they should have been lower on the list for those people who want to assign blame for a natural disaster.

I was bored so I found the “Alan Combs” radio show and gave a listen.  They were on about how the tax cut are part of the reason that New Orleans is in trouble.  That money diverted from work on the dams and such was sent to Iraq.

This is bullcrap.  The government spends however much it wants to spend, on whatever it wants to spend it.  Then they go back and look at their tax receipts for the year and say, damn, we’ve got a deficit.  How did that happen?

I’ve actually been working on a little project all morning and you guys get to see the fruits of my labor:
Nifty Chart

The tax revenue has been fairly stagnant for the last 10 years.  It peaked between 1999 and 2001 (dot-com bubble), but after the “massive tax cut” it’s at the same level it was in 97-98.  Corporate taxes have not been drastically reduced, they too are at 1998 levels (not that it matters, as those taxes trickle down to you anyway).  Two things that can be gleaned from this:

1). As I stated countless times before, Clinton’s phantom surplus came from off-budget windfall, specifically, surplus from Social Security.  We’re being duped on budget numbers by off-budget surpluses being appropriated to make things look better than they are, and have been for over 35 years.

2). Taxes are not the problem.  Tax revenue went up over 5% ($89b) in 2004.  SPENDING is the problem.  Example, taking the war costs out of the equation cuts the deficit for the last 2 or 3 years in half.

Political opponents cannot have it both ways; if you’re going to complain about the deficit, then make cuts in the budget and stop crying about programs being defunded and children starving to death on your front stoop.  You are spending more than we are giving you, then charging us interest on the money that you borrow from us.  STOP THE BLEEDING.

The PERSONAL INCOME tax revenue has been fairly stagnant for the last 10 years.

corrected.  Sorry.

Have you ever been to New Orleans?  There’s looting on your average Friday night there.  Anyone who left there home guarded simply by a door lock would have lost everything anyway, so why not stay?

This just exemplifies what a craphole New Orleans is.  It is very bad when all things are right.  I feel bad for the people who got stuck there because they were unfit for travel and for those that left only to have their lives and property blown away.

For everyone else I feel little pity for.  It is no great secret that Nola is under sea level.  It is no great secret that even a rain storm will kick off the pumpign stations.  It is no secret that hurricanes bring with them a lot of fucking water in a variety of ways (rain, surge, waves, etc). 

When the governor issues a madetory evacuation order, you packup your valuables and persons and leave.

Honestly either the governor or the president needs to declare martial law on New Orleans and put a stop to things.  If people are shooting aid workers and the poor bastards that chose to stay behind then the kid gloves need to come off.

As for Moore.  He will use any event to attack The President of the United States of America.  It does not matter to him if he is wrong, lying or embellishing. He merely makes an argument and expects us to believe his emotional appeal rather than checking on his (usually dubious) facts.

Of course the left will use this disaster as a political tool against the administration. Why does this surprise anyone? These are the same folks that use our dead soldiers as political tools with or without their families’ permission. But don’t worry, someday a Democrat will get back into the oval office and then it will be O.K. to fight wars for our national interest and natural disasters will just be acts of God again.

As far as the looters go: I think you have to discriminate between them. People taking food and water is one thing, guys running out of Best Buy with 47 inch plasma screens should be shot on sight. It only takes a couple before everyone else gets the picture.

Further proof that Moore-on has no human feeling at all.

As for the looting, it seems to me they’re being more dumb than not caring. I saw a clip of this one guy coming out of a store lugging a TV with him. Now let’s see, his home is probably underwater to a degree, and even if it wasn’t, there’s no power. What’s he going to do? Haul it under his arm for a while until this is all over? God gave you a brain mister, please at least try to use it.

I swear last night on Fox i saw a guy with a shopping cart full of new Nikes and A1 steak sauce. WTF?? Who the fuck is eating steak in NO for like the next year? Maybe he had a freezer full of steaks going bad and planned on grilling them up on his roof or something? i doubt it.

As far as the looters go: I think you have to discriminate between them. People taking food and water is one thing, guys running out of Best Buy with 47 inch plasma screens should be shot on sight. It only takes a couple before everyone else gets the picture.

I agree with this 100%, in theory.  I think with everything going on down there, the cops don’t (and shouldn’t) have to do “baggage checks” on looters.  Although I understand that people need to eat, I think this is too much to ask.  Police are already undermanned on a good day, start throwing in stuff like National disasters and I think you will overwhelm them immediately.

To take it one step further, the sooner ALL the looters, pillagers and plunderers are off the street, the sooner resources can be utilized to get aid and stuff in there.  As long as chaos rules, no relief effort is going to happen.

They need to get everyone out of that area.  While they are doing that they need mandatory curfews and rules and they need to enforce them rigoursly.  Unless there is an emergency, in this case someone’s life is at IMMEDIATE risk, you have no business walking around.

In the short term, crowd dispersal techniques need to be utilized.  Once the crowds are dispersed they need to keep them that way.  Then they can round up the roque stragglers and deal with them.  This will make it much easier to get aid to the area and it will be much quicker without the distraction of the urban vikings.

What’s really odd is, I always thought 3 feet of water would be a pretty effective crowd disperser.  These guys must be hard up for a TV.

BTW, if I were a cop in that situation, I’d shoot the TV rather than the person.  Unless he is startled and drops it on his head, it’s non-lethal, he doesn’t get the TV, and I would assume that everyone gets the message, Dirty Harry-style.

What do the looters have in common with Michael Moore?
They’re opportunists, they thrive on tragedies and the paths to their objectives are laden with shit.

They need to get everyone out of that area.

I think this is key.  Getting food and shelter to all of those that need it.  Here is an idea.  I don’t know if this has been thrown out there before, but why doesn’t Carnival or Royal Caribbean or Norwegian Cruise Lines sail a couple of their cruise ships into the area to provide temporary shelter and/or transportation for the victims?  I seem to recall that something like this was done for the SuperBowl this past year (to supplement a shortage of hotel rooms in that area).  Could there be some incentive provided to the cruise lines to get them to help out here as well? 

Since New Orleans was basically below sea level, why don’t we treat this similar to the sinking of a ship where all ships in the area are called upon to help out?

Just a thought.

What’s really odd is, I always thought 3 feet of water would be a pretty effective crowd disperser.  These guys must be hard up for a TV.

It is amazing what people will do in the name of greed and jealousy (just watch Fear Factor).  I have read some comments in the news of people saying the looters are justified because these people have been put down for so long. 

There is a difference between food and plasma tv’s, but the situation is so awfula dn police so undermanned it all has to slide…

Anyways I think people’s true colors show when things go wrong and to shit.  The city of New Orleans is certainly showing their true colors loud and clear.

In all fairness to New Orleans, the looters don’t represent the city any more than the terrorists represent Iraq.  It’s true there are idiots and idiots who support the idiots and idiots who pretend that the other idiots aren’t idiots, but the majority of the population evacuated when they were ordered to evacuate.

why doesn’t Carnival or Royal Caribbean or Norwegian Cruise Lines sail a couple of their cruise ships into the area to provide temporary shelter and/or transportation for the victims?

Something like this is in FEMA’s disaster plan.  You may actually see this happening.

It is amazing what people will do in the name of greed and jealousy (just watch Fear Factor).  I have read some comments in the news of people saying the looters are justified because these people have been put down for so long.

Yea I read the comment made by that guy as well.  He was talking about the way people act when they are oppressed for so long etc.  On that note, it’s funny how these oppressed people won’t put this kind of effort into getting a job and working past their oppression.  Oppression in this country self inflicted.  I am sick of hearing about these boogiemen that keep people down.  I am also sick of the excuses they make when they things that they blame on being “kept down”.  Bad behavior is just that, oppressed or not.

Oppression in this country is self inflicted.

What kind of sick punk would shoot at a rescue vehicle? I mean, I suppose I should expect this kind of behavior from humankind, based on history and current events and National Geographic, but it still amazes me that people could actually do something that despicable.

The question is, are the families of these looters the ones who are complaining about how there aren’t any supplies?

I think they should round up all of those looters, tatto the American Flag on their foreheads, arm them, and ship them over to Sadr City. That ought to kill two birds with one stone.

OK, here comes another long one.

I’d love to find out where these thoughts originate. You know the ones, the “Bush is responsible for global warming”, “Bush caused the levee’s to break”, “Bush lied to start the war”, “Iraq is doomed”, “The sky is falling”, you know, those.

The left doesn’t stop to THINK about things like this. They are incapable of doing so, as that would be directly contrary to their spoon-fed world view.

Somewhere, there is someone that is saying: “You don’t need critical thinking skills, because I will think up some whacky-assed conspiracy theory, candy-coat it with flowery prose, and back it up with facts that I fabricate, and force feed it into your lazy, degenerate minds.”

Liberals get a whiff of this mental fertilizer and go all wonky with it, thinking it’s true. They really are smoking the best shit.

It’s the party of party-poopers, the nay-sayers and profits of doom that speak for the looney left. They scream about how bad stuff is, yet do NOTHING to change it.

They are “The Chicken Littles”.

Maybe more people would listen and take note of the Leftists if they weren’t so goddamn annoying. About every. little. fucking. thing.

I’d like to slit each and every one of their throats with Occam’s Razor.

The beauty of this, at least for them, is that the central theme of their arguments are as unsound as they are. They don’t have to base a statement in fact, because even when they get called on it, they can conveniently come up with another whopper to replace the first, and go on, business as unusual.

For example, let’s listen in:

Leftist: Bush caused the disaster of Katrina

Rational Person: Really? The President himself got on the hotline to Mother Nature, and convinced her to brew up a storm and slam it into Louisiana?

Leftist: It was his rejection of the Kyoto accords that caused global warming to heat up more and stronger storms.

Rational Person: Really? The failure to ratify Kyoto; the same Kyoto that no other significant producer of greenhouse gasses has ratified, and in direct opposition to the historical record that shows otherwise; has caused larger and more powerful storms, and in under 4 years. That’s quite the pair of butterflies wings you have there. Where do you come by this vast wealth of atmospheric sagacity?

Leftist: Well, I read about it on a website. But that’s not really the issue. All that NOAA scientific jibberish is just part of the rightwing coverup to make environmentalists look unedumicated. The real issue is that he didn’t give those poor people enough warning. He should have seen this coming. He should have evacuated them.

Rational Person: Really? I suppose that you have conveniently forgotten that there was a MANDATORY EVACUATION order issued to the citizens of the Gulf Coast, and yet, for reason’s unfathomable, many chose to ignore the order and “ride it out”?

Leftist: Well, yes, but they’re poor, and they couldn’t afford to flee for their lives, the administration should have had an evacuation plan.

Rational Person: Really? What is it with you leftists and “pulling out”? How can there be so many of you still? Nevermind. Do you not realize that state and local governments are tasked with that very same mission? The same local and state governments that drove through the streets of New Orleans megaphoning: “Hey! If you haven’t left yet, you probably should get in out of the rain”? Furthermore, evacuate them to where, exactly? New Orleans II, the spare we keep in Kansas, just in case?

Leftist: Well, we should have a National retreat location, a great big “safe-room” where we can run to when we’re in danger, but we don’t, because all the “Homeland Security” money is being spent on “the war on terrorism” and the suppression of personal liberties though the “Patriot Act”.

Rational Person: Really? I, for one, have to say that the whole Patriot Act thing seems to not be working, because people like you are still shooting off your mouths and aren’t in re-education camps. But I digress. You do realize that the threat of terrorism is a tangible, man-made, threat? It’s one that you can put your thumb on and say “I can do something to mitigate this risk?”. Hurricanes are massive weather systems, randomly occurring and wandering around, regardless of human attempts to persuade them otherwise? The average hurricane liberates some 5.2 x 10^19 Joules/day energy in cloud formation and rain production alone? That’s roughly 10,000 times the energy liberated by the bomb we dropped on Hiroshima. Humans can’t build anything to defend against that sort of force. It would be like (literally) farting in a windstorm.

Leftist: Well, the levees, it was all about the levees… Bush halted construction of the levees to funnel that money into his war machine in Iraq. They failed because he stopped building them.

Rational Person: Oh REALLY? Bush personally got on the phone to the Corps of Engineers and said; “Fuck New Orleans, I have a war to pay for...” I think not. I ask you again, why is it the federal government responsible for the safety of a municipality? Furthermore, there is absolutely no indication of “stop work” on US Army Corps of Engineers projects related to flood management and prevention, and specifically, there has been an average increase in the USACE budget of .25B/year since the end of the Clinton administration. So, unlike USACE levees, that argument doesn’t hold water. Well, Category 3 Hurricane levels of water at least, which is what the levees were actually designed to protect against. Not Category 5 once-in-a-half-century whoppers like Katrina.

Leftist: Well, yeah, OK, but the war in Iraq has taken all the troops, and helicopters, and artillery from The States, and without them, there won’t be any soldiers to rescue people and shoot looters.

Rational Person: Oh REALLY? Explain to me, then, how 124,000 National Guard troops have been mobilized from 17 southeastern states, not one of which has more than 25% of it’s personnel deployed either in-theatre (in combat support roles) or overseas/CONUS to backfill active duty positions so that warfighters can be deployed to combat theaters. I’d also like to point out that when National Guard units deploy, they don’t fly their (regrettably, hand-me-down) helicopters and airplanes around the world to fight the badguys with. There are enough helicopters in New Orleans to be taking ground fire; I figure it’s safer to be in Baghdad.

Leftist: OK, well, gimme a minute to check KOS for the real reason this is Bush’s fault. I’ll regurgitate that pre-chewed 60’s Hippie Leftover Tripe for you in a minute.

Rational Person: You go ahead and do that, I’m going to go do what I can to help those poor bastards.

I think they should round up all of those looters, tatto the American Flag on their foreheads, arm them, and ship them over to Sadr City. That ought to kill two birds with one stone.

They’re Kerry voters.  They want peace, man.  They’d never support such violence.

What kind of sick punk would shoot at a rescue vehicle?

The same ones that shoot at police and fire crews.

As for that long post.  I certainly do not think that any rational person believes that Bush or his policies had anything to do with Katrina.  I understand the jury is still out on whether global warming is man made or a natural phenom. but the truth is, even if it’s caused by man, Bush couldn’t have stopped it even if he went whacko enviromentalist.

The Kyoto accord for those of you who don’t know, was yet another UN attempt to get socialist level controls on the US.  The biggest polluters were exempted from it anyway.  It was simply another tool to redistribute our wealth and power and to world control.

As for the levees (sp) ronnie nailed that one.  NOLA has plenty of cash to lure in big business and have pro sports teams.  They could have easily fixed their own damn water problems.

The flaw in the “Bush cut funding, so the levies broke” is that the canal barrier is one of the ones that was upgraded already. So, upgrade or no, the force of Katrina overcame it.

There’s actually been a pretty good discussion on the subject in the Forums. I think that there’s a link to them on the main page.

Some interesting facts I found at Junk Science, first part is the “ accusation “, second is the facts ;

The misguided U.S. position is particularly galling because America is the world’s leading producer of carbon dioxide and other gases linked to global warming. With only 4 percent of the world’s population, the United States emits about one-quarter of all greenhouse gases.” (Hartford Courant Editorial)

One-quarter of all greenhouse gases? Same old media, um… confusion.

What they really refer to is America’s contribution to estimated anthropogenic GHG emission (liberation), not including the water vapour that accounts for more than nine-tenths of the greenhouse effect. The global sum of anthropogenic GHG emission (liberation) is something under 4% of estimated global total GHG emission (liberation), not including water vapour. Biological activity in forests, seas and soils produce more than humanity by a ratio of about 2 dozen to 1, then there’s volcanic activity, crust weathering… the complete sum is unknown.

The real situation then becomes: at most, America may be responsible for as much as one-fourth of 4% of 10% (thus 1/1000th) of the greenhouse effect that keeps our planet habitable.

Bush signing Kyoto would have changed nothing ;

Similar to the famed National Debt Clock near Times Square in New York City, one counter racks up the immense compliance costs of the Kyoto Protocol, conservatively estimated for the counter’s purpose at $150 billion per year.

If the astronomical compliance costs don’t impress you, we’ve got another counter — one that shows an estimated running total of the potential “warming” avoided by the treaty’s restrictions on greenhouse gas emissions.

Both global warming skeptics and advocates agree that the potential amount of warming that hypothetically might be avoided through Kyoto Protocol implementation is roughly 0.07 degrees centigrade by the year 2050.

So to be able to show any activity on the clock, we had to go out nine places to the right of the decimal point — that would be potential temperature changes on the order of a billionth of one degree Centigrade.

Combined, the two counters indicate that the Kyoto Protocol costs roughly $100,000 to “prevent” just one-billionth of a degree of warming. So at the bargain price of just $100 trillion, the average global temperature could theoretically be lowered by 1 degree Centigrade.

In all fairness to New Orleans, the looters don’t represent the city any more than the terrorists represent Iraq.

I base my opinion off its crime statistics and other information I have learned before Katrina. 

My general feeling about people is they are defined (and in this case NOLA as a whole, not specific individuals) by how they act when things go bad.  While the people who are looting property (with the caveats of food, water, meds, etc) do not represent everyone in NOLA they do define what NOLA is. 

It may not be a stretch that these same people define all that was bad about NOLA before KAtrina.  Given the rampant chaos, shootings, fires, amounts of guns in the shelters…

I think the MANDATORY EVACUATION would have been more sucessful if they had turned off electrical power, water, and gas lines BEFORE Katrina hit.  Then people would have had more incentive to leave and find somewhere that had a TV and beer.(outside the path of Katrina)

Turning off water and power before the hurrecanes hit is a standard procedure in the Cayman islands.  That way no one gets hurt with downed power lines. (no power) Water is not wasted. (turned off) Gas lines don’t burst and burn out of control. (no gas) Then once the storm has passed they start turning things back on carefully.  Section by section.

I think the MANDATORY EVACUATION would have been more sucessful if they had turned off electrical power, water, and gas lines BEFORE Katrina hit.  Then people would have had more incentive to leave and find somewhere that had a TV and beer.(outside the path of Katrina)

What would have been the reaction of people if this were done and Katrina fizzled out?  Seriously, do you think no one would have been screaming about how the evil republicans ran people out of their homes for no reason?  Call me brilliant, but when a MANDATORY evacuation is ordered, I’m gone.  No incentive required.

D’ya ever hear of a no-win situation?  That what it’s like to be a Republican.  If anything happens in which a negative side can be found, THAT is the fault of those “evil Repugs” and their Kyoto/tax/homeland security/whatever policies.

their Kyoto/tax/homeland security/whatever policies.

Ooops.  Sorry about that.  By including the Republicans homeland security in this list, it almosts implies that the left also has one.  My bad.

homeland security policy

(joke would have gone over better is I would only just usepreview!)

ahhhhh, screw it.

Of course, they would have screamed that the Evil Republicans…

Friend of USA - On top of things as usual, thanks for that post.

As FOUSA posted the US being a huge contributor of greenhouse gases is a myth.  In addition you will not find one credible scientific study that says conclusively that carbon dioxide causes global warming.  I have even heard scientists say that CO2 does not have the properties necessary to do such a task.  I am not a scientist but I think man made global warming is hoax perpetrated by a bunch of dirt worshippers that put man at the bottom of living things that need to be saved.  I find it strange that the same guys who claim that the earth has had numerous ice ages, ie several heating and cooling cycles, now claim man is responsible.  Who was driving SUV’s around 10k years ago to get us out of the last ice age?  Mythology.

With that said, Kyoto, The World Court, WTO ET AL are Marxist enterprises designed to reign in superpowers and strip them of their wealth and dominance in the world.  Who the fuck would want that?  Surely not the superpowers?  Oh it must be the little countries that think they should benefit from our hard work.  Typical.  Funny how they are so interested in saving the world from CO2 but they exempt China, India and every other third world country that is industrialized.  I don’t have the figures but I guarantee you that those places cause more problems with pollution than we do.

One last thing.  One volcano eruption puts more greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere than 100 years of industrializations.  Now they are saying the US has too many cows because their farts are opening holes in the ozone.

This is earth worship.  It’s a religion, it is not science and it sure is fuck isn’t fact.

Thanks Ronnin,

Another thing, but I don’t have a link this time - I read somewhere that 18,000 scientists have signed a petition against the one single study on which Kyoto is based.

Also it said that a lot of scientific journals were refusing to publish work that tried to disprove that one single study…

Anyway it is more and more obvious that this whole Kyoto thing is not really about reducing global warming but reducing the economic power of the USA - because no one can compete with the USA.