I Need a Shower
Those of you who have been to my blog (cue crickets chirping) or seen my comments at RTLC know that I’ve been fairly harsh with the Bush Administration and the GOP. So much so that as a small-government, free-market, free-trade federalist, I’m no longer considered “conservative” in some circles.
But one of the things I’m doing, now that I’m a contributor at Moorewatch, is becoming more familiar with his views, his work and his website - and the Leftists contained therein. And while reading his website makes me feel like I need a shower for my brain, it is a wonderful reminder of why I will never ever be a radical leftist. Over there it’s all “impeach Bush, destroy the corporations, let’s have a march”. All linked to approvingly by Moore. And I thought I’d have to go back to college to see such ignorance again.
Today, Mikey links approvingly to a Creative Loafing review of his movie. I have to believe this is for entertainment purposes only. I grew up in Atlanta laughing at this “alternative” rag. Certainly, Moore has to be giggling in his sleep knowing that he posted this on his website.
Anyway, a light fisking is in order, since the article represents everything that drives me berzerk about the healthcare debate. And presumably, one or two people are having their opinions formed by this tripe.
Besides, it’s been a long week and I feel the need to go Cheney on someone.
“That’s the object of the health-insurance companies,” explains Henry Kahn, a physician, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention epidemiologist and Emory professor. “They make obscene profits by not paying for health care when people need it.”
This non-sequitur comes after a description of disability insurance, not health insurance. But you always know you’re going into dangerous waters when the phrase “obscene profits” comes up. If this professor or this writer can articulate the difference between a profit and a profit margin, I will eat my copy of Free to Choose.
I would also note it would be far more difficult for insurance companies to behave this way if the consumer’s power had not beenstripped away by the Feds.
The Smiths had health insurance. But as the illnesses claimed their toll on the Smiths’ health, America’s evil – that’s the only suitable word for it – system of medicine undermined the lives they’d worked decades to build.
This is the quote that practically has me shaking with rage. Evil? Evil?! Evil?!?! What precisely makes our healthcare system “evil”? That it has made AIDS, MS and diabetes controllable ailments? Or that it worsens its infant mortality and lifespan numbers by trying to save premies other nations let die? Oh, I know! It’s the free care that millions of uninsured people get every day in hospitals around the country.
As much as I loathe HMOs, I can’t bring myself to call them evil. Greedy, yes. Stupid, no question. But evil? I can’t stand socialized medicine. I’ll call it stupid, misguided, destructive. But evil is quite a word to be opening up—and one that is particularly galling in a movie (and an editorial) that smiles approvingly on the murderous, thieving Fidel Castro.
Finally, Sugg’s talking about the Donna Smith sob story. This is a 52 year-old woman who was ruined when she developed uterine cancer while her husband had arterial problems. I guess they’d be better off in a socialized system, where they probably would have been allowed to die. But at least they would have died cheaply.
Yes, those evil Fidel-loving commies have a wonderful health-care system – and they live an average of three years longer than Americans. The Cubans provided care comparable to anything in America – the same care every Cuban receives.
I don’t think I can say anything that will match the utter stupidity and moral vacuousness of this statement. Well one thing. Sugg’s lying about their lifespan. I think he has Cuba confused with France, which does indeed have three years on us. This is an understandable mix-up (at least per-Sarkozy). But I would argue the tragic French lack of violence, drug abuse and obesity might be a bigger factor than our “evil” healthcare system.
According to the World Health Organization, we spend proportionately more of our gross national product on health care than any other nation – yet we rank 37th in the performance of our medical industry. France, Italy, Spain, Oman, Austria and Japan top the list.
The big problem is the 30-some percent of our health-care dollars that are wasted on the insurance companies. By comparison, Medicare, the health program for oldsters, operates with about 3 percent administrative costs.
I dealt with these Numbers in the Dark in my Ebert Fisking. In short, Medicare doesn’t administer Medicare; and our 37th ranking is partially because we’re not socialized.
Here in Georgia, the rubes live under the illusion of rugged individualism – a myth propagated by those who steal our money. In voting for George Bush, Gov. Sonny Perdue and the rest of the GOP, middle-class Georgians elect pickpockets and thieves.
Yes, Democrats are so honest and true, it makes me weep. But notice that we now get the elitist condescension. Those who oppose socialized medicine are just deluded “rubes” who don’t know no better, no sir. And “rugged individualism” is a four-letter word. We’re all in this together—one big family. I’m sure Michael Moore feels our pain, too.
Kahn, for example, heads a group of physicians who tallied Georgia health-care expenditures for 2003 at $37 billion. By eliminating the insurance companies, Kahn says, we’d save $8 billion. “With that we could provide health care for everyone in Georgia, without decreasing what’s paid to doctors and hospitals, and we’d still save at least 2 percent of that $37 billion,” he says. “Everybody is covered and costs go down.” U.S. Rep. John Conyers, D-Mich., has proposed a similar national plan.
I’ve been spent half an hour trying to find an analogy to make a joke with. I can’t. The statement is so ignorant, it’s as if he said our healthcare system would be better off run by Martians. Again, this is based on the myth that Medicare’s overhead is 2% (but wait, earlier he said it was 3!). I’m sure that a money-vomiting government program with no supervision will be beautifully efficient.
Never ask a Leftist for financial advice, that’s all I can say.
But in some ways, this is precisely what free-marketers are suggesting. With HSAs and greater insurance freedom, the consumer would have more money in his hands and more control over it.
Thanks, I will!Hello, Karl Marx. Call it socialized medicine if you want.
But America is on life support that only a single-payer, no-insurance-company system, one that also regulates drug companies like utilities, can cure.
America is getting really stupid editorials written in alternative magazines. It’s a crisis that only government regulation of the media can cure. Calling the Fairness Doctrine!
And regulating drug companies like utilities? This would be the same regulation that caused massive blackouts in California and, according to the Left, is destroying the planet with fossil fuels.
But the comparison is just plain stupid. My water company puts water in my house. Water is not terribly complicated. The universe pretty much got it down 300,000 years after the Big Bang. It’s not going to suddenly mutate into a human-resistant strain of water. And plumbing goes back thousands of years. The biggest challenge my water company has is a burst main. The water company is not going to invest millions of dollars into some experimental water only to get the daylights sued out of them when it turns out that, here’s a surprise, people with heart conditions have heart attacks.
Comments
I can’t understand why people can’t understand. All you have to do is take a good look at the social programs already in place, and you see that they are all struggling. Why on earth would anyone want another one, one so huge that it would dwarf all the other dumb social programs put together?
As far as I can tell, the whole thing comes down to two different opinions of the competence of the average person. Proponents of public health care, public schools, public assistance, and other wealth transfer vehicles believe that the average person isn’t capable of making choices.
Proponents of free enterprise seem to believe the opposite, that people will generally make choices that will provide the most benefit at the lowest cost.
Is there something in the water up there in congress that fills the people there with false intellectual superiority?
I’m sorry to disappoint everyone, but I saw SICKO and I HAVE to be honest and admit that everything I saw in it rings true. Hey, we’ve all been there. We’ve all been up against the health insurance companies more times than we care to admit....But, hey, I’ll admit it! And I’m tired of having to foot the healthcare bills for my kids because they can’t afford health insurance! I’ve also been to europe and received medical care there. It was great! And it was FREE!!
Why are we arguing with FREE HEALTHCARE?? Are you all tryiing to say you LIKE paying through the nose for your insurance and for your medical treatment? Have Americans all gone crazy? I thought we WORSHIPPED the almighty dollar. What kind of capitalists are you anyway, when you support the people who are ripping you off?
I’m not getting what your point is......AT ALL.
We’ve all been up against the health insurance companies more times than we care to admit....But, hey, I’ll admit it!
Why don’t you provide us with a specific example?
And I’m tired of having to foot the healthcare bills for my kids because they can’t afford health insurance!
Why don’t you provide specific details?
I’ve also been to europe and received medical care there. It was great! And it was FREE!!
What country? Specific details please . . . especially about that “free” health care. Surely, you don’t mean no one paid for it?
Belcatar, not all of us that are in socialized health care are unhappy. By the same token not all of those who pay for health care are unhappy either. It isn’t that people don’t understand, it’s that their opinions differ from yours. The last time I checked people were allowed to have different opinions.
Buzz, in all honesty why would BlancheDUB provide more specifics to you? If he/she has spent half the time reading this website that I have, he/she would know that to do so would be pointless, because you would simply take one sentence from an entire post and attack it.
I have spent half of my morning as well as time last evening reading the posts, reading the comments, cringing at the ignorance of some people (when I say that I was referring to some of the hate mail receieved), and also cringing at the way the “boys club” on this website browbeats anyone who has the nerve to post. There never is a real debate about issues. Someone posts a comment, and rather than really discussing the content, people continually pick out one or two sentences and attack it. What this does is cause the original poster to defend one specific sentence, and their attention gets drawn so far away from the original topic that they eventually stop posting, realizing it is fruitless, and the powers that be on this website declare “victory”.
Which is the point that I have come to, as well. This will be my final post here, because my original reason for venturing here is I believed there would be some real debate, not brow-beating or a group of people stroking each other’s egos through typewritten word.
lowbacca, from everything I’ve been reading this morning you are probably the regular poster on here that I respect the most. I don’t agree with everything you say, and my opinion differs from yours on some of the things discussed, but I don’t see you doing what several other people here do, and I think this post board would be better recieved and more active from “outsiders” if there were more people like you here.
PeteMate, it’s a shame that they chased you off because I found your posts quite compelling, even though your opinions differed from most here. It is a shame about the flag burning thing because all that did was lend way for regular posters here to attempt to systematically rip apart everything you said. The temp work you were talking about, there is truth to both sides. Some people do choose temp work because it is more flexible. For others that is all they can find. I worked for a temp agency when I was still in the United States and it was never short term for any of the health care workers that were listed with us. For several of them it was the only work they could find in their profession because nursing homes and hospitals preferred temp workers so they wouldn’t have to give them benefits. I doubt, however, you will even read this post, as your last time here was June 16th.
Contrary to popular belief on this website, not all Moore fans are “Mooreons” as you like to throw around here. I also do not believe that when you do get a message from a true moron who is shooting off his mouth it is because he’s the chosen spokesperson for all of us, nor do I believe that Moore’s website sends them over, as was referenced on different posts.
Jim, you accused me of splitting some awfully fine hairs on my post, which I still do not agree with. If I said “All Americans are cross dressers”, and someone replied with “No, no Americans are crossdressers.” Those would be two diametrically opposed sides, and in the middle of those two statements would be the truth. Now, if I said “The American Government passed legislation that required all Americans to be cross dressers” that would just be entirely inaccurate with no merit whatsoever. Also, the very things you have accused me of I have seen several times through this website that you yourself have done. “Splitting hairs” as you say. Picking one sentence out of an entire thought and beating it lifeless, so to speak.
Using the example above re: crossdressing… if an outsider came to this website and said “All Americans are crossdressers” it would have been refreshing and even welcoming to see “well (insert name here) that isn’t entirely accurate and I’ll give examples of why”, not “are you really THAT stupid?? See, these mooreons know nothing”. Or, “hey idiot, crossdressing is actually two words… cross dressing, do people in your country not know how to spell? See, that’s what happens when you socialize health care.”
Michael Moore went to Cuba, and stated it was for “journalistic” reasons. Because of this you decided that because he said that to gain access, his movie “Sicko” should be seen as a journalist’s story and thereby held at a higher standard than his previous ventures. How is that not taking one small thing and running with it? Apparantly Michael Moore said something about not being able to show his film in Tehran or going there (I haven’t found where Michael Moore said that yet; there’s only so much time in a day to read) and from that someone happens to contact a lawyer friend who coughs up United States/Iran laws, finds somewhere that it says for the most part trade is ok, and from that draws the conclusion that Michael Moore must be lying.
You have brought up some very good arguments on this site in opposition to the tactics that Michael Moore uses, and I do believe that in an ideal world we should all only have to arm ourselves with the truth, and speak that truth to ellicit real change. But that isn’t the case in our society. Michael Moore isn’t a journalist. He is a documentary film maker. He uses the media with which he is provided to speak his opinion. And he uses examples that support his opinon, and yes leaves out examples that would not support his opinion. But really, do most people approach every subject 100% objectively? If people did you wouldn’t have lawsuits about missing pants or messy divorces. In our society I think you need mouthpieces to rattle cages and make some noise because unless someone does, no one takes notice. If people as a whole tried to tune in more to their environment and the people around them I wouldn’t hear horror stories on CNN about a woman stabbed three times, and people just walking on, even stepping over her, while she bled to death. Finally someone stopped, but it ended up being too late. Unfortunately more often than not that is the society that we live in; people have no desire to become involved until there is something to be gained.
And the same thing happens on a government scale as well. Countries don’t go to war in other countries unless there is something to be gained for themselves or revenge. There are several examples of this through history, including WW2.
American health care is not perfect. Socialized health care is not perfect. With American health care there’s not a significant wait time, you pay premiums, and there’s no guarantee you’ll get the help you need. With socialized care you could have a substantial wait time, but you do know that no one is going to tell you that you can’t be helped. There is good and bad in pretty much everything. It all boils down to each individual and their opinion. Some Americans will feel that privatized health care is the best choice while others will feel that socialized care is the way to go. Some Americans will be against the war and feel that it needs to end. Others will believe it is a justified war and should be seen through till the end. Some Michael Moore supporters do actually have a brain even though their opinion differs from yours, and others are raging idiots. Some subscribers to your website will have valuable thoughts and insights while others will continue to brow-beat and chase posters away who have the nerve to disagree with your opinion. Let’s face it, this is just a post board; I doubt anyone, such as PeteMate, particularly enjoy the virtual “swarming” that continually happens on this website. I know that I don’t.
MH, I hope you reconsider. You read and write well and I found your post insightful. Just remember, sticks and stones may break my bones, but cyberwords are ones and zeroes.
MH if you really think there’s no debate here, then by all means, get out. You were treated with respect, your ideas WERE debated and plenty more besides.
What you really wanted was people to agree with YOU. Since you aren’t getting it, you want to tuck tail and run away. Good. Go. You’re not adding anything of value to this site with an attitude like that.
It’s pathetic and cowardly and I was dead wrong to give you any respect in the first place. I see that now. Your true colors came out. I’ll expect you to keep your word and leave.
Buzz, in all honesty why would BlancheDUB provide more specifics to you?
Because broad sweeping generalizations are not facts. Funny how you accused bismark of the same thing on another thread. I mean really, MH, saying, “We’ve all been up against the health insurance companies more times than we care to admit . . . “ is not meaningful.
To be quite frank with you, I have doubts BlancheDuB is being honest.
With socialized care you could have a substantial wait time, but you do know that no one is going to tell you that you can’t be helped.
And that is a completely fabricated falsehood.
Here’s an example of a specific example: I was thinking about Universal Health Coverage and I started wondering how it would be implemented. Let’s take my situation, for example. I live in northern Maine, where there aren’t a lot of people, and consequently, not a lot of doctors. Now for the sake of argument, let’s say that Michael Moore’s movie caused a tidal wave of anguish and galvanzied the people into forcing the government to adopt a National Health Plan. Now I have a great insurance plan that will pay for all kinds of treatment. Unfortunately, the nearest doctor is 30 miles away, and he’s not a doctor, only a Nurse Practitioner. If I want to see a real doctor, I have to drive two hours south to Bangor. The gist of it is this: I’d have access to coverage, but not access to care. Does the fact that I’m entitled to have health coverage mean that I am entitled to have access to care as well? If that is the case, then the Insurance Plan would have to pay me extra money to cover the cost of my transportation to and from the doctor. So even though I chose to live two hours from the doctor, the government is going to take money from other people and give it to me. This is the kind of stuff we are going to have to deal with if Michael Moore’s FidelCastDrisneyLand ever comes true.
Note to MM- You say that not all people in Socialized Care are unhappy. Fair enough. I’m sure that there are many success stories. Then you say that not all people who pay for care are unhappy either. Ok, that sounds plausible as well. What I am confused about is this: Who pays for socialized care? Doesn’t everyone pay? Don’t healthy people end up subsidizing the ailments of people who are sick? This isn’t a matter of opinion. An opinion would be “It is good and right that people band together and care for one another.” I’m asking for a verifiable fact. Who pays for socialized medicine?
And I’m tired of having to foot the healthcare bills for my kids because they can’t afford health insurance!
Damn those kids...not being able to afford their own healthcare. How dare they come out of the womb not being able to pay for thier own healthcare. Why should you as a parent support them ;)
Are you all tryiing to say you LIKE paying through the nose for your insurance and for your medical treatment? Have Americans all gone crazy? I thought we WORSHIPPED the almighty dollar. What kind of capitalists are you anyway, when you support the people who are ripping you off?
Nothing is free. The thing is countries with socialized healthcare pay for it through taxes. So you can almost be guarenteed that the money would be coming directly out of your paycheck one way or another.
Damn those kids...not being able to afford their own healthcare. How dare they come out of the womb not being able to pay for thier own healthcare. Why should you as a parent support them ;)
Really. Why in my day we not only had to walk uphill both ways to school, we also had to pay for our own healthcare.
But seriously. I get so tired of the oh poor kids arguments. If you can’t afford health insurance for yourself and kid, don’t have kids.
It isn’t like it’s fucking rocket science or anything. We’ve had birth control for thousands of years and for at least the last few decades we’ve had extremely reliable and relatively cheap birth control.
Nothing is free. The thing is countries with socialized healthcare pay for it through taxes. So you can almost be guarenteed that the money would be coming directly out of your paycheck one way or another.
Ot of interest, has anyone got any stats as to whether people pay more or less for healthcare under each system? i.e. would it cost me more for health insurance than it costs me in taxes?
My guess would be that someone in my financial position pays less in the UK, and someone in Michael Moores financial position pays less in the US. Just a guess though - does anyone have any stats to hand?
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I wonder if Henry Kahn can define what an “obscene profit” is. It would be very interesting for someone to ask him that question on camera. One thing is for sure . . . it has to be way below a 6.41% net profit margin because that’s the average for HMOs.
There is a certain reality to running any business . . . it’s very simple . . . you either make a profit or you don’t. If you don’t then you aren’t going to be around long. Even non-profit organizations must create wealth or die.
People like Henry Kahn labor under the false impression that there is some magical fantasy world somewhere in which businesses make “moral” profits.
I notice where Kahn teaches at Emory University. Apparently, he must be clueless as to how and why Emory University exists, or why the Center for Disease Control is located next door, or why the American Cancer Society has moved to Atlanta, too. I wonder if Kahn knows who the Woodruff brothers were or the Chandler brothers? I wonder if he knows what evil corporation these guys controlled? I wonder if Kahn understands that Coca-Cola made an “obscene” 21.09% net profit last year? That’s over 3 times the average profit margin HMOs make.
And Henry Kahn works for one of the finest medical institutions in the world . . . the very one that an evil capitalistic softdrink company made possible. Maybe Henry Kahn needs to rethink his position on what an “obscene profit” is because he, in fact, is benefiting from this immoral practice.